Constitution of india

Well raised topic mr mohan g. You got very strong point. But its well settled now that neither courts nor parliament can change it. If parliament try to do so...SC says you cant basic structure of it. However I personally strongly believe That no rigid format based law/document can be implemented in true democracy. USA is best example for my point. They dont have any rigid written constitution. They knew the fact democracy cant be forcfully trapped into some rigid structure. That's why they lead world. Unfortunately. .here in India if someone dares to speak over matters like constitution, shortcomings in civil code (uniform) cos of islam...media, courts, our own parliament suppress the voice. They dont want to have even debate over such topics. Personaly I see biggest shorcomings in constitution are Reservation on base of caste not financial sratus, Five year plan, And most handicap feature of our constitution * it dont covers whole India. J&k got seperate constitution. Parliament may have given seperate laws to J&K under shadow of indian constitution but seperate constitution? Ridiculous Bottom line....I guess our netas wants india to be as it is.....so that they can earn and so that their upcoming generations. God bless India.

Excellent piece of informative article by Mr.Mohan Sandilya,I appreciate his efforts,enlightening the legal validity of the constitution,which the elected representatives of the Parliament since 1952 have not approved it to be a legal enforcement for the people of this country.

Originally posted by : Mohan Shandilya
	The Constitution of India is null and void ab initio as it was NEVER voted by the people of India, in whose name it was adopted on 26th November 1949 and came into force on 26th January 1950. The first elected Lok Sabha came into existence only in April 1952 on the basis of an adult suffrage. The Constituent Assembly which drated and adopted it was NOT an elected body on the basis of an adult suffrage but a NOMINATED body that too by the alien rulers. It was never got ratified by the elected representatives of the people in 1952. No referendum was held in India despite written committment by Pt Nehru to Lord Wavell the then Viceroy who had obtained the assurance in writing from both Pt Nehru & Jinnah that they will hold a referendum in their respective country once Independence is announce. It is a matter of fact that Pakistan did hold a referendum in 1948 but India failed. The admission on the floor of the Parliament by the then Finance Minister Dr Manmohan Singh that the system has failed India is a proof unto itself that We, the People of India need a new Indian Constitution. The present Constitution is majorly a copy of the Govt of India Act, 1935. European Union, Hongkong, Benin - all held required referendum. EU held referendum when it wanted to adopt a common currency EURO and also when it wanted to form European Union. This is a sign of mature democracy displaying respect for its people. In India, once we elect a government, we become victims of the misgovernance at the hands of the elected government till the next elections are held, and the vicious circle continues to harm our interest with wrong policies and total absence of timely implementation of law. Enforcement of Contractual Obligations in Indian courts has attained notoriety throughout the world. Thank you, and I express my gratitude in advance for your precious comments. Mohan Shandilya

Originally posted by : SAINATH DEVALLA
	Excellent piece of informative article by Mr.Mohan Sandilya,I appreciate his efforts,enlightening the legal validity of the constitution,which the elected representatives of the Parliament since 1952 have not approved it to be a legal enforcement for the people of this country.

Very important pieces of information.

This is the same sorry state even in the details of population that has been presented in the parliament. India is definitely not any small country. But, the figures presented is not the correct one.

 

There has been no policy what data should be collected & neither was / is data collected, stored, verified in a scientific basis. Data collectors have used pencils in all instances. There are no signatures & other implicatable information both of the person (Applicant) or of the data collector. Some data collectors fill up forms by themselves. Many citizens have given wrong information. Many citizens have not participated in the data. Many individuals have maintained multiple identities (Different names, different sur names, different initials, different addresses, different caste names, different states etc etc etc). Some families have crossed all that, have ghost (pseudo) employees & have drawn, draw salary on Govt rolls! There is no means to cross check any detail & the powers it be want it to be in this way for heredities together.

Who will write the Indian Constitutition again and decide the Rule making power for 120 Cr people of our Country ?  Where we have to select the persons in India or Abroad to write Indian Constitution again ?

it is said at Mr Nehru gave assurance to Lord Wavell. Was wavell elected representative of Indian masses.

Originally posted by : D.Dakshina Moorthy
	Who will write the Indian Constitutition again ....

 

11.7.16

"Who will rewrite the Indian Constitution?" EXCELLENT.

 

The New Design be foolproof, robost enough to meet the diverse needs, challenges of the huge population, geography that we are. It should take dimensions due to new knowledge, but be based on time tested principles. Fairness, transparency, equitability, acountability, respect to entire nature (All animates, inanimates) etc be the hall mark of the new design & no power be vested any authority to sanction killing of any animate/plant, consume/destroy more & more parts of the already denuded nature (water bodies, lands, mountains, etc). LET WORK ALONE GENERATE THE PAPER MONEY. LET WORK, WEALTH ETC BE REDEFINED ON REALISTIC PARAMETERS (Say consumption v/s replishment of natural constituents).

 

The New System be designed after simulating all possible situations at every milestone. Exit criteria be essentially specified at each of the instances. 

 

Let me assure that technologies have advanced sufficiently & time, distance etc, even for that matter langugage etc too are not any more that big a constraint. The magnanimous task that it appears will become too little the moment the exercise is taken up in all earnestness.

 

A step ahead, the point below is an attempt to list desirable parameters. More may pl. be added: 

1). Jobs, incubation support & related benefits should be treated on a seperate clause. The desirable parameters in that clause:

i). TREAT ALL EQUALS AS EQUALS & THERE BE NO DISCRIMINATION, PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT, CONCESSION TO ANYONE IN ALL MATTERS, AT ANY STAGE.

ii). No life long assurance & all that. Brilliant people be identified on a fair, transparent basis & given 10-15 years of incubation & nothing more. Then on, his/her staying on rolls should be based on one's contributions which will be evaluated transparently. Let no one get more or less than what s/he deserves / contributed for entire life).

              (No one should suffer, but let no one keep getting loads & loads just because s/he got her/his name scribed on the roll; while someone else suffers on & on. Everyone be made responsible for his/her life. No one be fed at the detrimental interest of another).

 

THE NATION DEFINTELY NEEDS CONSTITUTION-II. This need be met on war footing. Every wrong decision, silent corruption, twist & turn is costing some unseen citizen, natural constituent & are becoming irreversible damages. LOOKFORWARD FOR APT CALL / ADVERTISEMENT.

Originally posted by : Sudhir Kumar
	it is said at Mr Nehru gave assurance to Lord Wavell. Was wavell elected representative of Indian masses.

Constitution is a social contract. For it to be valid, it must have all the required ingredients of a valid contract. For any contract to be be valid, it must also include non vitiated consent or confirmation by the party/s entering into contract. Ratification does that. It is missing in the Indian Constitution.

 

The real reasons for missing ratification are sordid political dishonesty, deceit and treachery on part of the politicians of that time. It is a well settled fact of history that during negotiations with the British before transfer of political power, there were three different people making political claims to sovereignty - Congress representing the political interests of the Hindus(who had lost sovereignty about 1000 years ago), Muslim League representing the political interests of Muslims(who lost sovereignty in 1857-1858) and Akali Dal representing the political interests of Sikhs(whose sovereignty was suspended since 1845-1849).

 

Jinnah did not trust the promises of Congress, as he being a clever lawyer, was able to sniff the political strategy of Congress. He put his foot down for everything to be "decided" before transfer of power and it led to the sovereignty of the people he was leading. Sikhs did not have such leader to guide them and trusted those who were unworthy of trust i.e. the solemn promises of M. K. Gandhi and J. L. Nehru that no Constitution would be agreed without the satisfaction of Sikhs. Believing their false promises Sikhs opted to go with them. After the power was transferred by British, they reminded them of their promises. They were told to forget the promises since "times have changed".

 

When the Constitution was adopted without the consent of Sikhs, the representatives of Sikhs walked out and refused to sign it. Thus technically the Sikhs are not party to the Indian Constitution. Thus no ratification was done as they would have refused. Even later on in 1980s when they pressed for their civil and political rights, about more than a million of them were systematically genocided. It is all well documented in various books and documents. Same is also noted in a book Sikhs in History by Dr. Sangat Singh(a former high ranking officer of RAW), Publisher- Singh Brothers (October 1, 2002), ISBN-10: 8172052766, ISBN-13: 978-8172052768. The book is also available for free download from internet. The book also mentions about secretly planned "Operation Shanti". One can also search about it on the internet. It was a genocidal plan to be put into action. Some Army Generals refused to implement the plan. But plan got leaked and Indira Gandhi was killed to stop the plan from being implemented starting from the day of birth anniversary of Guru Nanak. Its all mentioned in the book. Portions from the book have already been mentioned earlier in thread https://www.lawyersclubindia.com/forum/Objections-against-proposed-arms-rules-2015-121734.asp

 

Ratification is a kind of referendum. Referendum is part and parcel of Common Law and the Constitution. It can be further confirmed by reading the para no. 2 of Statements and Objects of the 44th Constitution Amendment.

Originally posted by : Mohan Shandilya
	The Constitution of India is null and void ab initio as it was NEVER voted by the people of India, in whose name it was adopted on 26th November 1949 and came into force on 26th January 1950. The first elected Lok Sabha came into existence only in April 1952 on the basis of an adult suffrage. The Constituent Assembly which drated and adopted it was NOT an elected body on the basis of an adult suffrage but a NOMINATED body that too by the alien rulers. It was never got ratified by the elected representatives of the people in 1952. ...........

13.7.16

 

"Reply in a Competent RTI, filed with authorities has sufficient indicators that vouch the "NEVER VOTED" in the post".

 

In the same breath, the elite members be sounded that similar exercise has been done on 'Census' & the data etc are highly defective, questionable & SHOULD NOT be basis for any national decision.

Originally posted by : Sh. P Suresh
	In the same breath, the elite members be sounded that similar exercise has been done on 'Census' & the data etc are highly defective, questionable & SHOULD NOT be basis for any national decision.

Census data is collected with due care by due process of law under Census Act 1948 by Government of India. Are you questioning the trustworthiness of due process of law conducted by the Indian State and labeling it as questionable? If this is what you are saying then India is already a failed State and it has lost it's lawful legitimacy. Then everything has to be started from a scratch like it was done before 1947. In civilized norms it would mean everything has to be decided peacefully by referendum else the situation may become extremely nasty and violent.

 

Sometimes people hold a core belief that is very strong. When they are presented with evidence that works against that belief, the new evidence cannot be accepted. It would create a feeling that is extremely uncomfortable, called cognitive dissonance. And because it is so important to protect the core belief, they will rationalize, ignore and even deny anything that doesn’t fit in with the core belief - Frantz Fannon

 

The first step in liquidating a people is to erase its memory. Destroy its books, its culture, its history. Then have somebody write new books, manufacture a new culture, invent a new history. Before long the nation will begin to forget what it is and what it was. The world around it will forget even faster. A nation cannot cross a desert of organized forgetting. The struggle of man against power is the struggle against forgetting. - Milan Kundera

 

In keeping silent about evil, in burying it so deep within us that no sign of it appears on the surface, we are implanting it, and it will rise up a thousand fold in the future. When we neither punish nor reproach evildoers, we are not simply protecting their trivial old age, we are thereby ripping the foundations of justice from beneath new generations. ― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago 1918-1956

 

Also about "national decision" we must first understand the real definition of what is a nation. Only then we can move forward. Else we are moving on the path of self destruction.

 

There is no nation of Indians in the real sense of the world, it is yet to be created. In believing we are a nation, we are cherishing a great delusion. - Dr. B. R. Ambedkar

Originally posted by : Democratic Indian
	Census data is collected with due care by due process of law  ....

 

14.7.16

 

Summarily, it will be nice if the member account stops using the pseudo name & comes on his/her real, correct name.

 

Next, the lion's figure is nice. God bless all of his creatures. But, for God's sake, please do not use it in that space.

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Originally posted by : Democratic Indian
	......  did not have such leader to guide them and trusted those who were unworthy of trust i.e. the solemn promises of M. K. Gandhi and J. L. Nehru .....

 

The earlier post names the personage who made so many sacrifices in his personal life, led a simple life though he could have afforded a lavish style in bad light & it is an insult worthy of being cognized. His principles, that life style is more right, worthy of emulating today also & will be so hence forth too.

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The system that expects masses to contribute to it should be fully fair, transparent, accountable, equitable, fool proof. The process that is named is not so & the proofs have not been given. They could be scrutinized transparently then on. Wrong design concepts, processes, methodologies, basis come up with one sided decisions. Partial, wrong decisions should not be thrust on & on. Come off politics as means for lifetime of luxury.

 

The system design itself should change: "Contribute transparently, take transparently irrespective of who, what, when. There can be some cushioning, but nothing more. No question of saying anything else that is beyond the other person's control. A cat is a cat & a lion is a lion. Can we change that in this birth? Such parameters SHOULD DEFINITELY NOT form the basis for any yardstick ANYMORE. I should not be discriminated at on any impossible factor. No one else should be treated preferentially to my detrimental interest. I should enjoy of my sweat. I should be thrust someone else's botheration". Even God expects that of every of his creature. Let rules, concepts not get formed on impossible, unrealistic principles any more. Let no one be bothered for entire life time, while another person enjoys, enjoys on & on for entire life time, just on that.

 

Why keep bothering the already harried? Why not give the harried souls peace of mind, means to enjoy fruits of one's ingenuity, honest labor in this birth? 

 

Please think on ways, policies that will make everyone work & be responsible citizens. Enough is enough. Please do not deprive the zealous lot of ther lifetime opportunities, happiness due to factors impossible for any human.

Originally posted by : Sh. P Suresh
	Originally posted by : Democratic Indian Census data is collected with due care by due process of law  ....   14.7.16 Summarily, it will be nice if the member account stops using the pseudo name & comes on his/her real, correct name. Next, the lion's figure is nice. God bless all of his creatures. But, for God's sake, please do not use it in that space. -------------------XXXXXXXXXXX----------------- Originally posted by : Democratic Indian ......  did not have such leader to guide them and trusted those who were unworthy of trust i.e. the solemn promises of M. K. Gandhi and J. L. Nehru ..... The earlier post names the personage who made so many sacrifices in his personal life, led a simple life though he could have afforded a lavish style in bad light & it is an insult worthy of being cognized. His principles, that life style is more right, worthy of emulating today also & will be so hence forth too.

1. For your information it is the login id and not name. Even if it is my name, you have no right to tell me to use some other name or so called real or correct name. My name is my personal domain. I can have countless names and keep them changing every moment. It is my personal choice of God given freedom and liberty. Freedom and liberty is all about making free choices. I have made a free choice to use Democratic Indian as my login id. What is your problem with it?

 

2. I chosen to use lion's picture. It is my personal choice of God given freedom and liberty. Freedom and liberty is all about making free choices. What is your problem with it?

 

3. What real sacrifice did that "personage" make? Did he suffer life imprisonment or hanged to death? British did not leave Indian sub continent because of him. It is the Second World War that bankrupted the British Empire and the Indian subcontinent became a liability. They vacated not only Indian sub continent but almost 40 other colonies around the same time. Transfer of political power did not come by sacrifices by the majority in this country but by an accident of history. Almost 80% of sacrifices like suffering life imprisonments or being hanged to death were suffered by a tiny minority of this subcontinent. Please read the authentic history and not some concocted versions of "history".

 

Following is portion from the same book mentioned earlier in this thread. It clearly shows who Mr. M. K. Gandhi really was -

 

Before the proposals were announced, the Cabinet Mission and the Viceroy called a conference starting May 5, 1946, in Simla, of Congress and League leaders, to which Master Tara Singh as representative of the Sikhs, was also invited. Maulana Azad, President of the Congress, while objecting to parity between groups in the Executive and Legislature, was in favour of doing “everything possible to remove fears and suspicions from the mind of every group and community.” 147 As against that, on May 8, Gandhi in a letter to Cripps, objecting to the provisions of parity between 6 Hindu majority provinces with population of 190 million and 5 Muslim majority provinces of 90 million, wrote, “This is really worse than Pakistan.” Instead, he wanted the composition of the Central Legislature and Executive on the basis of population. 148 In the words of H. M. Seervai, “The Congress opposition to parity marks a watershed in the history of the Congress and its fight for the independence of a united India.” 149 Gandhi had now decided to break the unity of India, for he was not willing to allay the genuine fears of 90 mn Muslims. Seervai avers that “after the 1945-46 elections, nationalist Muslims could play no effective part in the Congress”.

 

Even more, a staunch Muslim like Maulana Azad became the mouth- piece for doctrines which he reported as “injurious to the unity of India.” 150 Moreover, “How little Azad counted in shaping Congress policy even before he ceased to be the Congress President (emphasis in original) is demonstrated by the interview which Azad and Nehru had with the Mission and the Viceroy.” 151

 

Gandhi, Nehru and Patel were now working at cross purposes with Azad who was still the President of the Congress. Gandhi also wanted to show Azad his place as a mere Muslim showboy when he wrote to him on August 16, “I did not infer from your letter that you are writing about my Hindus. Whatever you have in your heart has not appeared in your writing. . . . whatever you want to say about the communal problem should not be said without consulting me and the Working Committee.” 152

 

Gandhi’s ploy. When it suited him he would say he is nobody in the Congress. Now he claims special prerogative for “my Hindus”.

 

If Gandhi for the sake of ‘my Hindus’ would not offer the requisite assurances to 90 mn Muslims and consider Pakistan a better proposition than treat them equally, and brusquely shut up Maulana Azad, Congress President of six years standing, what fate could await the tiny 5-6 million Sikhs whom he never considered as a separate community? The Sikh leaders oblivious of the danger threatening them proceeded ahead non-challantly. Tara Singh pointedly asked Sir Pethick Lawrence on May 25, “What is the significance of recognising the Sikhs as one of main communities” and sought certain clarifications. 153 He instead should have asserted his position, but lacked clear objectives.

 

Listen to the interview of Retd. Justice Markandey Katju below -

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rjZctqGDlU

 

Practically in short he is saying that the Indian State has collapsed and is withering away. At around 19 minutes 27 seconds into the interview he clearly asserts that Gandhi was a big fraud, Subhash Chandra Bose was lackey of the Japanese, Tagore was a British stooge and the people have been be-fooled.

14.7.16

Originally posted by : Democratic Indian
	............ 1. For your information it is the login id and not name. Even if it is my name, you have no right to tell me to use some other name or so called real or correct name. My name is my personal domain. I can have countless names and keep them changing every moment. It is my personal choice of God given freedom and liberty. Freedom and liberty is all about making free choices. I have made a free choice to use Democratic Indian as my login id. What is your problem with it?   2. I chosen to use lion's picture. It is my personal choice of God given freedom and liberty. Freedom and liberty is all about making free choices. What is your problem with it? ............... Following is portion from the same book mentioned earlier in this thread. It clearly shows who Mr. M. K. Gandhi really was - ............... .......Gandhi's ploy........................

 

The answer is already there. SO, THIS IS THE LOGIN ID & NOT THE TRUE NAME. THUS, THE MEMBER ACCOUNT DOES ANYTHING & IMMATERIAL OF WHAT IS DONE, others will have to bear it. NOTHING CAN BE DONE.