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Cheque bounce case in uae

Page no : 2

bhuvanesh (Piping Engineer)     07 August 2012

Respected Sirs,

Thanks for your time.

I have still two following questions unasnwered. I thank u for your expert comments:

1. I recently heard that if a case is pursued in India by Advocates on behalft of UAE Police, then I cannot negotiate with bank for any repayment, in other words, Bank is not into picture anymore as the matter is between UAE Police (cheque bounce crime) and Indian Government, and so I have to respond to the outcome of legal proceedings initiated by the Indian Advocates of UAE Police or I have to surrender to police once my ARREST WARRANT is issued by police to appear before court (if UAE govt asks Indian Govts consent for extradition or judicial cooperation). Some advocates (on behalf of UAE banks) say that there is "mutual judicial cooperation and assistance' between Indian and UAE. Is there anyway that I can declare bankruptcy to Indian govt or indian Court as I have no property or no asset, not even a job in India now.  

2. My debts in UAE do not belong to one particular bank or single entity, but my outstanding debt of 55 lakhs is spread over 7 banks. For 6 banks I owe around 4 lakhs and for one bank owe 30 lakhs. As the situation goes, most likely all banks will present my security cheque which will eventually BOUNCE and result in Police case in UAE. My question is - whether all these banks will come toghether as ONE UNIT and start legal proceeding against me? or every bank will individuallly proceed against me?

V T GEORGE (MANAGER)     07 August 2012

 

 D           DO any body know of the following

Mr 1. In the case of Mr Bhuvnesh, Will Mr Bhuvnesh be deported to UAE as per the existing rules and treaty ? 

2)  2. . Will Mr Bhuvnesh be put in Jail in India for the Economic Offence he committed in UAE  ? In UAE there is Jail term for cheque bounce. Will this case if transferred to India be tried under Section 138 (NI) in line with CrPC 188.

3)    3.    After all the paper work in Dubai and through New Delhi, if the case is finally filed in India, will that be of Civil nature or Criminal nature initially ? In india under 138 NI, it is criminal case first and after jail term , then civil case can be filed if no penalty is part of judgement. Is that correct ?

R Trivedi (advocate.dma@gmail.com)     07 August 2012

These are interesting but straight forward to the point questions, before answering again it requires many points to be understood..

 

1. Cheque Bounce is a crime in both India and Dubai.

 

2. Security Cheque Bounce has been ruled by our Apex Court as no offense.

 

3. Cheque per say is no security against loan, loan giver is at fault if he gives loan based on only cheque

 

4. His cheque is not a plane vanilla cheque wherein he took some material and issued the cheque dishonestly, it was a security cheque given to Bank, which atleast in India may not face conviction even after prolonged trial.

 

5. Interpole may be involved by Dubai.

 

7. Dubai Bank can illegally hire some collection agent in India, who may harass, he should immediately file a police complaint if it happens.

 

8. Dubai govt can club all the offenses and can initiate the process of extradition.

 

Now the crux is in India cheque bounce has been ruled as regulatory offence not as any big crime, it is kind of quasi civil. Moreover no country keeps UAE in high regard as far as punishment aspect is concerned. So in my humble opinion at the worst he may be denied entry in UAE (he may not even attempt entry middle east), Interpole notice may be issued, some agent may harrass him, Indian government  also may initiate against him based on request from UAE (very lengthy process), but the best part is India is not going to deport him under any circumstances to UAE for cheque bounce that too for security cheque bounce. It will be a big political hot potato for Govt of India.

 

We must remember and court also takes into consideration that for extending the loan the bank or Finance Company or even Individual must take proper surety in the form of mortgage, if they rely only on a blank cheque slip, which is also not a cheque as per S.6 of NI Act, then it is the mistake of such agencies, if due dilligence is practiced at the time of issuing the loan, then it would have just been a civil recovery case, so under the circumstances our people shall not be cleared be court for extradition. 

Om Prakash Dhusia (HR assistant)     08 August 2012

Cheque Bounce case in UAE: First of all I must THANKS to all the participants in the debate but sorry to add with apology to Mr. Bhuvnesh who had made it very abundantly public and apprehensively had been asking very superficial questions but at the same time it is wise to buy umbrella before it rains. As we in Hindi say that, “KA BARKHA JAB KRISHI SUKHANE”.

a)      As per UAE law the loan is a civil matter between the bank and the individual but cheque bouncing is criminal in nature.

b)      However Mr. Bhuvnesh is not sure as to whether the monthly installments cheques or the security cheques have been bounced and if that be so whether the case has been made out against him in the court at UAE or not?

c)       If either of the cheques have been bounced then he has to ensure whether those have been bounced prior to his departure or otherwise.

d)      He is very much afraid of extradition to UAE as if he is citizen of some banana republic where he could be kidnapped or abducted at will by the agencies at UAE. He is undergoing some phobia of extradition and I would suggest that if bad has to happen then why not to expect for the disaster.

e)      If security cheque/s have been bounced and is not considered any evidence for conviction in the Indian courts (Many thanks to Mr. Trivedi for the update) then he can not be extradited to UAE because the extradition is based on a very simple fact that it should be considered evidence in both the countries. 

f)       As many of the Islamic countries follow Sharia or Islamic law and UAE is also one of the same then I do not think that the Indian Courts would readily accede to UAE demand for extradition of any Indian. (But sorry to add that it is my speculation).

g)      It is irrelevant whether bank or banks club the case together as the crime is a crime.

h)      The banks at UAE had disbursed Mr. Bhuvnesh the loan or issued the credit card without analyzing his capacity to repay including on the very simple guarantee that he was employed at UAE and earning a handsome salary and if he had departed to India before the cheque/s were bounced but he could not go back to UAE within six months due to home exigencies thus his re-entry to UAE was blocked and he lost the job because of long absent and now he had no source to negotiate with bank being penniless.

i)        And if the banks negotiate with the defaulters then presumably they also have bottlenecks in recovering their money.

j)        Many banks because of tedious formalities in recovering loan, hire the loan recovery agents at UAE and India but whether those recovery agents are recognized by the Indian law is another question yet to be answered but can criminal case be filed on power of attorney is another question?

k)      Notice had to be issued before any criminal proceeding is initiated against any individual.

l)        Under section 188 Cr PC if an Indian had committed any criminal offence overseas, he can be investigated in India wherever he is being found but international diplomatic protocol comes in the way and that complaint had to be routed through the appropriate channels.

m)    The cognizance can be taken by the Indian court but one can not be tried before sanction from the central government and as already said that Bounced Security Cheque is no ground for conviction and if the individual can defend himself properly in the Indian court then no conviction can be passed or if Mr. Bhuvnesh, god forbids is tried at Indian court then he can claim bankruptcy. I suppose bankruptcy is pre-mature at this stage.

n)      So far no such case had ever come up in Indian Courts, so we can only keep our finger crossed.

o)      If Mr. Bhuvnesh is in touch with the latest update then ex-ruler of Pakistan Mr. Parvez Musharraf has been declined by Interpol to be extradited to Pakistan due to inadequate evidence/reasons but laws do not apply universally is also the irony.  The applicability of Law depends upon the genre, creed, caste, color, religion, region etc.

p)      Red alert notice is also issued by the Interpol and the best precaution is that one should not travel by air which Mr. Bhuvnesh would not be able to afford presently if his monetary condition is true as he had stated in the LCI column.

Mr. Trivedi had been rendering a yeoman service and with due respect should be credited with many thanks for his sincere and appreciable guidance.

Regards.

bhuvanesh (Piping Engineer)     09 August 2012

I whole heartedly thank Triwediji for all his words, his time and his interest.

Also, George and Om Prakash sirs also deserve my 1000 thousand thanks.

I dont want to be considered as a 'criminal'.

Actually, if I was allowed to work in UAE peaceful without the bombarding calls from UAE Bank collection departments and UAE bank's unnecessary action of bouncing my check inspite of my clear information to them that I dont have adequate money in bank even to pay the monthly instalment. I had told bank that my financial siutation will improve as my company was considering a lumpsum bonus and salary increment for me, which would have happened if I had continued in job in UAE. If by any remote chance, UAE allowed me to work again there, I will surely pay off all my debts. So I have the intention to pay. But due to UAE rules, I dont have the source of situation to pay. So I cannot be termed as a 'criminal'.

Again, i dont want to be said that I committed a 'regulatory offense' when the cheque bounced. After all, I have given the cheque to the bank only as the Bank told me that they would keep my cheque as a 'secuirty' and will at no time use it for payment purposes. Inspite of that, the Bank presented the cheque and made it to bounce. It was purely a 'security cheque', not intendend for encashing or for recovery purposes. I never gave the cheque in any 'bad faith'. Bank should understand that fact that if anyone loses their job in UAE, they have no option as per law, but they will have to leave UAE for their home country and in such case, I dont think it is possible for anyone to pay off the debts when one's employment gets terminated unexpectedly. So the UAE situation and Indian situation is entirely different. In UAE, the repayment of loan depends on one's continuation of employment. So the scenario in two countries are different. Banks gave loan for me only because I was employed. So when my employment contract came to an end, Banks should understand that I have no source to pay. And in UAE, the worst thing is there is no provision for declaring bankruptcy.

Om Prakash Dhusia (HR assistant)     12 August 2012

Mr. Bhuvnesh, Banks for the matter of fact just dont promise anything in writing and do you think predated or undated cheques if banks demand are for charity? Come on Mr. Bhuvnesh, please don't start behaving like immature kids in this column. Banks have full right to utilize that cheque/s to meet their own ends. It is another matter that legally the cheque/s have been bounced or not but you have no adequate information and are only appehensive about it.

Did you lose your job or left the country on your own? If you would have been terminated by your employer then undoubtedly the sponsor had cancelled your Work visa or residential permit and in that case you were required to take clearance from the borrower bank/banks and the moment the bank/banks would had known this then undoubtedly  had bounced your cheque/cheques and initiated the proceedings to stop you from exiting the country. Please stop kidding though I am bit hard but truth is always bitter than fiction. You had fled the UAE is the hard fact.                  

The criminal or no criminal is the subject of the courts and no participant has branded you criminal in this column. You as a matter of fact wanted the advise/suggestion from the member of bar association or in other words the certificate holder of the qualification of a lawyer even if they may not be able to draft a simplest of application in the court.

My sincere suggestion is please update the information and prepare yourself to defend you in case of eventuality and I paray that god helps you.

Regards

advocate poonooran (legal advisor)     11 November 2012

anyone coming to this forum should come with clear hands.here mr.bhuvanesh must disclose the facts that what happened his case wether he received any call or summons from any polce or legal body there in uae.he says nothing about his investment also .

Om Prakash Dhusia (HR assistant)     13 November 2012

That is why I have aksed him many question about his status but he just remained illusive and did not say even a word. I am nobody to question his integrity and have no right ask the leading question about what he did or not but if he is really in trouble and wanted suggestions then it was my prime duty tohealp him out but if he would be sincere in his approach. God bless us all.

Regards

V T GEORGE (MANAGER)     13 November 2012

Bouncing of a cheque is the issue and not the 'reason' for bouncing the cheque. REASON IS RELEVANT IN INDIA AND NOT IN UAE. No body can bounce a cheq by doing an illegal business in Dubai. Such people do not operate cheque books. 95 % of the residents cannot do illegal business (like what we see in India) in Dubai. Uness Bhuvanesh happens to be in the 5 % exception. Bad investment can be many ways. Investment in Real estate , Investment in Business without capital etc are the main reasons. Unlike in India , every 3rd person you see on the road is a business man in Dubai. 5 % of such people become successful and become millionaires. The rest will perish. You get a credit cards on the road side. People normally have 5 or 6 credit cards. Blank cheques are given against credit cards as guarantee.  People are given loans just like that by reputed banks !!! . Guarantee is Blank cheque. Every day you will get calls from reps of banks asking whether you need loans !. You can start a business with zero working capital with dependancies on others finance. You just need only a license which you can get for dHS 20K. That is not unusual in this part of the world.  That is the reason why among 2 lakh Indians living in Dubai , 23000 cases of bounces cheques were filed in Dubai ( not in UAE) in 2011  and already more than 11000 cases in 2012, till June 25th. These are reported cases which will only be 10 % of the total cheques bounced, because litigation is difficult in UAE. The numbers are published in papers  (read previous forum pages) . 

Reason for bouncing is a comfort you get from the court in India and not in UAE. 

SEE ATTACHED 


Attached File : 197705564 chq (1).pdf downloaded: 183 times

samad (self)     13 December 2012

My dear brother Mr. Bhuvnesh, bother i am also in very very similar situation like yours. i also took some loans from uae and was repaying them very promptly till i one day lost my job... then as you know the local banks there flodded me with phone calls and visit at my home there... i even got a better job but then again they never allowed me work and repay.... for your information i should tell you that one day i even visited First Gulf bank from which i had a loan of aed.90,000/- ( my total loan being Dherams 3,00,000 about Rs.35lakhs) i literally literally cryed in their bank and i even held the feet of their manager and begged me to give me a chance to repay their loans by working... but he pushed me away from his legs and said "khalli walli ya haiwan" meaning get lost you animal.... this is what i faced while i was in dubai... somehow i managed to come to india, but then again those banks has appointed local recovery agents in indai and they are also calling me every alternet day... with all this i feel like commiting sucide... i am very helpless and even cant breath in my own country.... believe me i sware in the name of my daughters my intention was always to repay what i took... but those people never gave me a chance.... they always scared and tourtured me by using name of police and jail.... my wife also wrote a letter to honble. Rserve bank of India asking for their kind help... RBI inturn forwarded my case to local news paper in my city... but and the news paper contacted me by email and wanted to meet me.... but i never met them because i am afraid that they might limelight me and again banks will make my life worst than a hell.... this is a fourm of qualified lawyers... can someone please advice us what to do if... also i sould tell that i also havent got a single penny out of my loan amount to india... i paid that in the interest of other banks and towards traffic fines... towards house rent.. and i made partnership with some indian their in house rent business but when recession started we suffered heavy loss... thats how i lost everything.

1. local collection agents sends summons to me on behalf of uae banks.

2. my father wants me to go to jail or die, and when ever the banks collection agents from india calls my home he gives them my phone number... and when they call me on my mobile i just switch off my mobile after hearing that they are from so and so bank...

3. i beg my indian advocate brothers please provide me with some solution. please.\

i shall always be greatful to you sirs.

V T GEORGE (MANAGER)     14 December 2012

I am not a practicing lawyer and so my information may not be 100 % accurate.  I am only a CA+LLb with no practical knowledge as I am in job now. The  information I have is as follows

1. This case has to be done in UAE and then a verdict is to be carried to India via the Indian Embassy and Indian Foreigh Ministry , New Delhi. 

2. Prosecution sanction from govt of india is required to proceed legally in India. 

3. I think ,this case will be a Civil nature case only in India . Guarantee cheques are not that accepted in Indian Courts.

4.  Calling by illegal recovery agents is illegal. You can file a complaint at the nearest police station and they will have to take action against these people who are calling. 

Adv  R Trivdei had given detailed informations in previous forum discussion which you may go through. 

Running way after taking loan and credit card facility is a crime . But process of recovery in thiscase by the lender is illegal . So you may approach the police and give a complaint that you are getting calls. Let the lender proceed legally as per law to recover this.

We are not in a Banana republic  !

 

 

V T GEORGE (MANAGER)     14 December 2012

in other words , Mr Samad do not have to commit suicide. You may carry on with your life and family as normal. He may wait for the proper legal resolution in this case. He can tell the debt recovery agents who call that "they have no right to call" and tell them to file a case and proceed legally. 

File a police complaint if they call again.

Explain to your father as well that this will be settled legally through the court and not be the illegal recovery agents who have no right. Their tactic is to intimidate and collect cash. This shpould not be allowed.

Go by the legal process and settle the cash if you have .

ANY PRACTICING LAWYERS IN THE FORUM CAN COMMENT AND GIVE COMFORT IF THEY FEEL NECESSARY.

Om Prakash Dhusia (HR assistant)     15 December 2012

Dear Friend,

First of all let me be very clear that none of the lawyer in the world will help you for nothing because they are all professionals and not in to some charity to entertain people free of cost. Even if you would be able to pay them their fees but what would be the guarantee that he or she would really be able to extricate you from the mess. Do not consider every lawyer wearing a black coat and white bow would really be worth its salt. Though it may look harsh to read but there are 60 to 70% of the Lawyers in India who may not be aware as to what is NRI, NRE, FCNR and many other jargons attached with Indians who either work or having taken a temporary residence abroad. Kindly do not treat this column as panacea of every ill because many of the lawyers have joined this column to solicit the customers either for themselves or for somebody who they work for. I do not blame every kettle which is black. There are some nice people who can render you good advice but you would not listen to them as you needed a black coat and white bow man to advise you or guide you which would be very difficult in the present environment. I have been in the Gulf for 21 years but I did not find anyone in there who would ever had offered me free tea costing 50 fills in UAE and 50 dirhams in Qatar during my days at Gulf so is in India too.

The problem is that you are just behaving like pigeon who closes his eyes when it sees a cat which meant that If it can not see the cat then the cat would also not see the pigeon and very effortlessly the cat devours the pigeon. Running from the problem is not the solution. You have taken loan of 300000/- Dirhams convertible to IRS. 4600000/- at present rate of exchange and lost all the money in bad investment which happens and it may not be exaggeration but nobody would believe you because we pre-judge the people and that includes you too (please remember that you need not to explain as to what you did with that money because that is none of the business of anybody) but wanted the bank to be compassionate as if banks are also some charitable trusts. Had it been Qatar and Saudi Arabia then you would not have been in India but straight in the jail thanks to requirement of exit permit which no sponsor would give in such situation.

I must say that you did the right thing by coming out of UAE and reached your home at India where at least some of the people including some of the Magistrates and Judges are not cruel like people, police, and the Judges in the Gulf and they pre-judge you if you are Indian . But there is one very nice thing which I would always admire that no one touches you in the Gulf if you have proper residence documents and limit yourself to performing your job and do not involve in other affairs unlike in India where the man in uniform, man in the government chair, man in the authority could even kill you with impunity in the name of administration of Law and order and the paper tiger the Human Rights Commission would look the other way round. In the Gulf a real culprit is booked for offence (may be few exception too which I do not deny) unlike in my country where even Judges are lathi charged by illiterate policemen in the name of Bandobast.  I do not mean that the lathi wielding policeman should be higher qualified than the Judge but only to say that why the peace loving unarmed people be lathi-charged.

Now do not be afraid of the local agents but be brave to encounter them on the phone and if required in person too and if they threaten, use un-parliamentary language, intimidate you, harass you then either report the matter to police, take shelter under the Court by filling complaint under Cr PC 156(3) if police doesn’t listen to you, with all the details of the bank and the agent or if not then have the nerve to reply to the agent or agents in their own language because they can not take law in their hand except that they can haul you in the local court if have the requisite documents with them. I mean POA from the bank in UAE where you had defaulted.

If you have deposited the SECURITY CHEQUE which normally is demanded blank by the banks before loan is sanctioned then it had no documentary value in India. (You may be having the check list issued from the bank in which they may have demanded the security cheque including post-dated cheques during the submission of the application for loan or before sanctioning the loan) The other cheque or cheques which may have been bounced by the bank if carries the date after your departure from the UAE would be treated a fraud in India (You can prove your departure by the exit stamp from the immigration UAE and arrival stamp at India).

I know you are desperate, you are frightened and have no alternative but please don’t beg from the people in this column many of whom are not even humans though I am indebted to the people who started this column with the noble cause of helping the hapless people but slowly it was taken over by the likes of opportunists or sadistic. You must have noticed that very few people submit advice in this column.  

Let the recovery agent file a case against you in the Local Court at India but you have to believe in you first and rest assured that you would not be extradited to UAE on the basis of bounced cheques in UAE as I have mentioned above. Claim for insolvency before the Court at India but that would be the last resort. Trust the God, Allah, Ishwar, Wahe-Guru or whatever you name him but that remains the one and the only the almighty who is present everywhere.

Regards.

V T GEORGE (MANAGER)     02 January 2013

Now the UAE Government had woken up ! They made 2 amendments 

1. Loans to finance Realestate is capped to 50% of the value of the property for expatriates as against 90 to 95 % before . This will streamline speculative markets . Only people with cash can buy. 

2. The cheques issued as guarantee to banks against Loans and credit cards are no longer a criminal offence. All expatriates jailed for this reason will be released immediately. This will be a civil offence . 

SEE ATTACHED . This is Dated 02 Jan 2013 (today)

V T GEORGE (MANAGER)     02 January 2013

 

 

Now the UAE Government had woken up ! They made 2 amendments 

 

1. Loans to finance Realestate is capped to 50% of the value of the property for expatriates as against 90 to 95 % before . This will streamline speculative markets . Only people with cash can buy. 

 

2. The cheques issued as guarantee to banks against Loans and credit cards are no longer a criminal offence. All expatriates jailed for this reason will be released immediately. This will be a civil offence . 

 

 

SEE ATTACHED . This is Dated 02 Jan 2013 (today)

 


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