Illrgal practice of probation
Gaurav Pathak
(Querist) 27 May 2014
This query is : Resolved
I joined a private firm in Sep 2013. It is clearly mentioned on my appointment letter, " I'll be on probation for 6 months. On comletion of 6 months of my employement. I will be deemed as confirmed unless specifically mentioned to me in writing". It's 3 months after I completed 6 months. My senior HR says he will look for 2 more months. My performance is much better than their expectation. They didn't even inform me in writing and couldn't specifically tell the reason for extension. Now what should I do? Please help. It's urgent.
Devajyoti Barman
(Expert) 27 May 2014
Since it is private firm, it is difficult to effectively implement the terms.
Better negotiate with the HR persons to confirm your job.
Gaurav Pathak
(Querist) 27 May 2014
Can I complain against them? Where if yes?
Sankaranarayanan
(Expert) 27 May 2014
Yes you approach the head of HR. If you are not satisfy then approach the higher authority ,
Rajendra K Goyal
(Expert) 27 May 2014
Try to have amicable solution, however in private concern they hardly compromise, if you want to continue with the job, you should accept.
Start searching another job and till than have a meeting with the seniors,let us hope for positive outcome.
Guest
(Expert) 27 May 2014
Practice of probation is not illegal, as even the Group-A (Class-I) Officers of the Government of India have to undergo a probatiobn of two years at the very beginning of their service, but none of them have so far come forward to challenge the orders of the Government ever since the independence of India (1947).
However, non-issue of formal orders by the HR is a case of harassment. Since your appointment indicates about deemed confirmation, you may simply address your letter to the HR that according to the terms of appointment you have deemed the date of confirmation with effect from ... (date) after completion of six months of probation. Also ask them to confirm date of confirmation as ... (date), as per terms of appointment. They cannot issue post-dated order of extension of probation after the deemed date of cnfirmation.
Kumar Doab
(Expert) 27 May 2014
The employer himself leave apart your senior HR personnel, can’t breach the T&C (service conditions) inserted by it in appointment letter/contract of appointment drafted by it, and signed with employee.
You are lodging complaint that too verbally with wrong person i.e. senior HR personnel since he is not your employer.
He has miserably failed to process the extension of confirmation in time ( as being verbally pointed out by him, and not in writing) and hence he is resorting to unfair practices and tactics.
The appointment letter issued to you shall prevail.
What are the benefits that were to be passed on you after confirmation of service, and what is the loss suffered by you?
If at all you wish to point out do so in writing under proper acknowledgment, by preferably letter thru redg. post addressed to good offices of appointing authority, MD etc………………with a copy to you.
The employee should not stay with employers/establishments that do not implement good HR practices.
Don't waste your time with such employers.
You have a fair and valid reason due to breach by employer (thru HR personnel) to contemplate separation.
It is suggested that you may not draft your communication on your own and should seek consultation and advise of elders in the family, Lawyer/law firm, employee’s union leaders, trade union leaders.
Gaurav Pathak
(Querist) 27 May 2014
Hi All,
Happy to see that you showed sympathy in my situation.
The answer for Mr. Kumar Daob's question is, "after confirmation of service, I should have received hike in compensation which most of employees get based on their performance."
As I told you my performance is above their expectation so they fear they will have to give me a raise on salary which is the next step after confirmation.
Secondly, The senior HR and executive director have very good friendship. they are more like family. So doesn't matter, if i complain, they both will surely lay illogical points against me.
Kumar Doab
(Expert) 27 May 2014
Logical or illogical until it is in writing it may not grant any opportunity to contest or accept.
If it is stated in appointment letter, HR policy, service rules and regulations that after confirmation of service there shall be an incremental increase ( and as per some matrix.......)in remuneration then company can confirm the service without any increment.
If you have printed version of the policy then you may demand confirmation with increment.
The friendship of Sr. HR, Director has nothing to do as far as legalities are concerned.
The company may confirm the service with meager increment say................ Rs30/pm, if there is no defined matrix for increment.
If you have performed well then it is the time to negotiate better position and remuneration with employer with Good HR practices.
Guest
(Expert) 28 May 2014
Mr. Gaurav,
When senior HR and executive director have very good friendship, you should not have come with the problem at the LCI. You could well have approached them to solve your problem. But, you seem to be going the legal way against them inspite of they being friend of yours.
Moreover, even in spite of your being HR Executive if you feel helpless when HR seems to be so pathetic even in your own case, we can imagine the plight of all other employees of your company. So, I can only feel pity about you, if you cannot get your own problem solved within your own unit, being the part and parcel of HR, itself. Do you still you feel that senior HR and executive director have very good friendship. What a controversy?
Advocate. Arunagiri
(Expert) 28 May 2014
Leave behind the probation and confirmation, what is your real problem?
Gaurav Pathak
(Querist) 28 May 2014
Dear Dhingra Sir,
No one has yet spoken like this before against delayed procedures. Since, this now happened with me, I think it's time I should come forward with logical arguments. As you said being an HR if I can't resolve my issues how about the rest of the eployees then. I shall today, firmly put my point with them.
Dear Arunagiri Sir,
My problem is that I haven't been issued the confirmation letter which I ought have received 2.5 months back as my appointment letter says.
Kumar Doab
(Expert) 28 May 2014
You should not only watch but defend your interest too and build written record under proper acknowledgment.
You are in the company and closest to the facts and you alone would know what is what and what shall be suitable to you!
If you succeed to get letter of confirmation with good increment proportionate to performance and like in case of other employees, then matter should stand closed to your satisfaction.This is your aim too.
The aim of Sr.Hr and probably appointing authority, Director is not so as posted by you.
If you have a hint that the matter is not going to be resolved to your satisfaction then:
---if you contemplate separation then you shall claim since by a verbal order your confirmation was said to be extended hence the notice period/pay applicable should as in case of probation.
---The company may claim notice period/pay as in confirmation is applicable, as the clause in appointment letter as posted by you is self explanatory.
--- If at all incremental increase in remuneration is on record in printed version of the policies, the company may claim that the issuance of letter was delayed and increment (meager………………….?) is granted.
---You may get less or nothing by incremental increase in remuneration and pay more by way of notice pay if you choose not to serve notice period.
If you decide to serve notice period the company may delay FNF, relieving and may even level some charge.
It shall be appropriate to record (audio/visual) the statements of senior HR for use if the need be, at appropriate time in appropriate forum.
If you do not posses any evidence then it shall not be easy to prove your contention and the onus to prove can fall upon you.
Don't waste your time with such employers.
Being a HR personnel yourself you can analyze and decide what would be best for you.
Be smart.
Gaurav Pathak
(Querist) 28 May 2014
Thanks for the detailed analysis Doab Sir,
Well, my primary responsibilty is recruitment for which I have full record from my day of joining. I have hired as many people in last 9 months as they never witnessed since their operation started.
Secondly, last night I've had a conversation with some departmental heads whose department I hire for. They suggested to raise this issue in front of Director and then inform them later. Since this is a US based firm. So ultimate authorities are at US.
Keeping that in mind, I shall firmly ask for my right. I already have started looking outside opportunities but skipping this situation is not a sustainable solution.
Hopefully, I'll get what I deserve.
Thanks for your support.
Guest
(Expert) 28 May 2014
Dear Gaurav,
You should have taken my post as a pointer to the attrocities that other employees would also have been facing, when being in HR your own case gets obstacles from the HR, itself.
Kumar Doab
(Expert) 28 May 2014
I am in full agreement with all posts of Mr. Dhingra.
Our hunch is that you shall not be getting relief.
Of course for a committed focused and determined employee everything is possible.
You may apply your rapport, goodwill, and exceptional levels of negotiation, reasoning, persuasion, persistence skills.
The HOD's for whom you have been recruiting and producing are asking you to take and give feedback and they may limit their intervention to that level.
Your own Senior/HOD/Director is not lending a compassionate ear to you.
Even if the ultimate authorities are in US the company has to be registered in India and Manager/Owner as described in registration certificate under (Name of state) Shops and Commercial Establishments Act and Director is subordinate and fully accountable to law of the land.
Gaurav Pathak
(Querist) 28 May 2014
After last two comments of Dhingra and Doab Sir, I feel like there is no way out but to rely on the mercy of my employer. Since, I've not been into cajoling and sweet talking with these people but focused on my KRA and KPIs. So, that I guess ironically is my reward.
Anyway, they still have to issue my a confirmation letter by default since it's clearly mentioned in appointment letter.
Though, they might find an excuse not to raise my compensation.
Well, confirmation letter would be a step forward.
Kumar Doab
(Expert) 28 May 2014
@ Gaurav,
This is after your last post in this thread.
Don’t give up and attempt to get incremental increase in salary. Giving it up would imply surrendering your rights. Defend your rights.
Confirmation of service without any increment proportionate to your performance would raise question marks in future endeavors. Recruiters put such things under magnifying glass.
Separation on such parameters would be a justified cause.
The HOD’s that have valued your performance can vouch for your credentials and can be willing to be your references in your resume.
The vindictive and zealous line managers are well known in the industry.
The performers are in a great demand.
Continue to focus on your KRA’s and KPI’s and learn to deliver unparalleled performance.
Developed common sense is better than IQ/EQ/PQ.
There is always a place for taskmasters and performers.
Lesson learnt is: employee should be tactful and must know how to press hot buttons and when.
Although the post authored by you is discussed but you would know better than anyone else the situation at your hands and best approach to situational management.
Choose the one that suits your aptitude now and long term goals.
Persist.
Rolling stone has more mass. Still waters run deep.
Both are true.
Taking a cue from last post of Mr. Dhingra…………………………………….if such is the conduct of Sr.HR/Director and their conduct is atrocious, if they litter nuisance, if they practice rowdiness, if they mar the rights of employees, then every one or many would be feeling suffocated and may like to vent their anguish.
The bosses in US might not let it pass unnoticed.
We have seen enough times that: the one that is BOSS today is doorman the next day and out of doors next day.
In industry ‘NO One is Indispensable.’
In future you may graduate from recruitment to other disciplines of HR practices e.g. IR and might need different skill set………………………….Learn from situations.
In the end it is emphasized that don't make up your mind to give up and firm up your strategy for your situation.
Gaurav Pathak
(Querist) 28 May 2014
Few minutes earlier, I had conversation about this with HODs. They were curious to know whether I talked with director or not. Since, The director was occupied in meeting throughout the day and left early so I couldn't discuss it today.
But I already have prepared my proofs (a copy of appointment letter by underlining the respective section) and will surely put it in front him tomorrow.
Let's see what happens.
Guest
(Expert) 29 May 2014
Convince the Director with effective presentaion of your case. There should not be any valid reason to withhold your confirmation by the HOD or the Director.
In private organisation the employee need to keep his eyes and ears open and besides verbal communications, it is quite necessary for the employee to make his formal (written) timely communmication as his tool to get his rights in time.
Gaurav Pathak
(Querist) 30 May 2014
Hi Dhingra Sir,
You won't believe hat happened today. I did exactly what you mentioned above. But the director openly said we won't confirm you. My Sr. HR also said either work like this or quit or escalate where ever you want to I shall not confirm you. They asked me to resign but I have not done it yet.
I am totaly defeated. I hope now you might understand how much dirty practice there are into.
Guest
(Expert) 30 May 2014
So, you have realised now what is usually said and what is done by the authorities in any organisations. Since you are new, you will learn a lot by the passage of time during your service in different organisations.
Since you were living in fools paradise, when you believed that senior HR and executive director have very good friendship, only then I made my second, but irritating, response just to awaken, rather instigate you to face the reality of life.
Now, your first option is to start written communication on this very instance and by referring their verbal reply ask them to make you aware of the ground for their intention of not confirming you.
Contrarily, the second option for you is, instead of keeping yourself at the mercy of their egoistic behaviour put your papers to resign but must make a polite mention in your resignation notice that you were submitting your resignation only on their asking.
However, if you want to fight with them legally against injustice, the third option for you is to drag the company in the court of law for violation of terms of appointment and take order of the court to confirm you. But, still, if you get confirmed on the order of the court, must not serve the organisation any more after that and resign to save yourself from the anticipated conspiracy on their part against you..
Kumar Doab
(Expert) 30 May 2014
Did you record (audio/Visual) the meeting and statements made by Sr.HR/Director?
You may answer it!
Would the HOD’s submit their feedback to higher ups in US?
It was already mentioned that;’ Our hunch is that you shall not be getting relief.’
Demanding resignation can be termed offence and deemed termination.
Now the your written correspondence should preferably be drafted and structured by a competent and experienced Labor Consultant/Service Lawyer to suit your long term goals and interest.Spend quality time your lawyer NOW.
Although since you were in recruitment so there might be a feeling that you may not be covered as a ‘Workman’ however let your lawyer ask you asset of structured questions and opine that you would be covered as ‘Workman’ as in ID Act and as ‘Employee’ as in (Name of your state) Shops and Commercial Establishments Act or not.
Your job might be limited to assessing the job application, criteria’s as per some scale and matrix issued by your company and in such a case you may be covered as workman.
The Sr.HR/Director are bent on extending confirmation without issuing a written communication to this effect and extract resignation from you so that on record the matter is closed that you had no complaints and left on your own, and that they are not trapped and affected in any way.
Your lawyer may opine to narrate the minutes (mentioning dates, names………………….etc) in writing addressed to …………………………………….and also bosses in US (highlight your achievements and download copies),mention that your conduct-charchter and discipline has always been appreciated in office, and assign a unique reference number to your representation ,under proper acknowledgment either before you submit resignation or in notice of resignation (mention notice period/effective date of resignation/last date in office) and also in subsequent communications………………………………of course under proper acknowledgment, with a copy to you.
You must mention that NO Tasks are pending at your end, routine duties be assigned that can be completed within and up to expiry of notice period, and to whom you should handover the charge within and up to expiry of notice period.
If asked to obtain NOC/NDC retain copies, and attach with your final resignation on last date in office, of course under proper acknowledgment, with a copy to you.
Download exit policy, FnF policy, HR policy, service rules and regulations, conduct and discipline rules, appreciation mails, performance vis a vis KRA’s, KPI’s etc…………………………..NOW.
The access to record may be blocked anytime and later company may not produce even in court of law.
You would need these in future ventures.
Remain amiable and gentle, during meetings, your verbal and written transactions.
It is almost certain that the heads shall roll.
Proceed under the expert advice of your lawyer.
