Please help - dual employment law . !!
Lynch
(Querist) 15 September 2011
This query is : Resolved
Hello Sir,
I am facing a great trouble.
I am currently working in an MNC 'X' whose date of joining is 7th-SEP-2010, and the releving letter from my previous company(another MNC 'xx') stated my release from them is 8th-SEP-2010.
Now I had confirmed through mail with 'X' that my date of joining shall be 9th-SEP-2010, but the HR of 'X' had called me for some document submission / induction process on 7th-SEP-2010 and has put this date to be my date of Joining on my appointment letter.
Now I am getting a good Opurtunity with an MNC 'XXX' but they are questioning this date of "releiving from 'XX'" and joining in "X"' since the dates coninsides.
Last day of working in XX:8-SEP-2010
dATE oF jOINING in X :7-SEP-2010
(though my date of joining was confirmed on 9th-SEP-2010)
When I am asking 'X' to please change my date to 9th-SEP-2010 since it will hamper my whole career, they are not able to say if this can be done or not done.
Kindly advice me as how this can be corrected since this is becoming a case of dual employment and no company shall ever hire me due to this case of mine.
I AM VERY WORRIED..
PLEASE GUIDE AS TO WHAT CAN BE DONE TO SORT THIS MATTER...
THANKS IN ADvANCE.!!!
Raj Kumar Makkad
(Expert) 15 September 2011
You can in writing make request to your previous employers to correct their typographic error in record to avoid any future complication and keep these request letters with you and use these while going to new organization as this shall be treated only a typographic error and not a dual employment as you fear.
R.Ramachandran
(Expert) 15 September 2011
If Mr. Lynch had not received salary for the period 7th and 8th September, 2010 from MNC "X", that on that basis itself he can ask the HR of MNC "X" to correct the records and to issue a fresh certicicate. But I am not sure what is the real position. Only Mr.Lynch has to confirm.
Guest
(Expert) 15 September 2011
Yes i do agreed with Ad. Makkad sir, but we cant ignore the above statement as said by Adv. Ramachandran.
prabhakar singh
(Expert) 15 September 2011
you are right in your conception to what has been pointed out by Mr. Ramachanran.
Raj Kumar Makkad
(Expert) 15 September 2011
I have suggested to do get correction from either of the previous employers and there is no contradiction between my views and that of Ramachandran on this point.
Lynch
(Querist) 15 September 2011
Hello Sir,
I problem is that I was very young that time(1.5 years exp.) when i acceptied my appointment letter from my current employer and did not cross check the dates with my releiving letter of my past employer.
The fact is my current employer 'X' has started paying me from 7-SEP-2010
and
my past employer has paid me upto 8-Sep-2010.
I have requested my current employer 'X' to change the date to '9-Sep-10 but they say it depends on the Auditor.
Please guide me as to how to resolve this issue of mine as this miscrepency cannot not allow me to work in any firm in future.
Please help. !!!!
AAK
(Expert) 15 September 2011
as said by you "I had confirmed through mail with 'X' that my date of joining shall be 9th-SEP"
you can confront this mail to X company and request to change it as its clearical mistake.
R.Ramachandran
(Expert) 15 September 2011
Whether you were young or old is not the question.
Why are you not confirming whether "you received salary for the period 7th and 8th September, 2010 from MNC "X" or not?
Lynch
(Querist) 15 September 2011
hello Sir,
I confirmend that I had received my salary on 7th and 8th September, 2010 from my Current Employer 'X'. But I am ready to pay it back as It should not have been given and its a matter of my whole career now since I canot be employed anywhere if my current employer dosent change dates from their side.
The Auditor 'X' says the salary paid on 7-8 Sep,10 cannot be deducted from my current mothly pay.
Please advice me as to what can I do to save my career If my current organisation 'X' is unable convince their auditors/leagle Team to change my dates to 10-Sep-2010.!!!!!
prabhakar singh
(Expert) 15 September 2011
"The fact is my current employer 'X' has started paying me from 7-SEP-2010
andmy past employer has paid me upto 8-Sep-2010."
SO IS THE FACT AS STATED BY YOU!!!!!!
THE CURE IN MY OPINION LIES IN FACT IS THAT OFFER PAY BACK OF YOUR SALARY FOR 7th and 8th September 2010 TO YOUR CURRENT EMPLOYER ALONG WITH A LETTER OF REQUEST TO TREAT YOU HAVING JOINED ON 9th September 2010.
In alternate you can request your previous employer to relive you from effect of 6th September 2010 by paying back salary received for 7th and 8th September 2010.
But it is not a matter of LEGAL OPINION where you shall be found always wrong,young or old ,no mater, RATHER IT IS A MATTER OF LIAISING AND CO-ORDINATION WITH CURRENT EMPLOYER AND NOT OF ALTERCATIONS BUT OF POLITENESS AND PERSUASION .
prabhakar singh
(Expert) 15 September 2011
BUT IT DOES NEED TO HAPPEN EITHER WITH HELP OF CURRENT OR PAST EMPLOYER ??
YOU HAVE CREATED MESS BY NEGLIGENCE FOR WHICH YOU ARE PLEADING YOUNG HOOD????
The big question is that you received salaries at both the ends.They say it can not be deducted,but you state that do not deduct rather recover back from you.
prabhakar singh
(Expert) 15 September 2011
i request experts to continue to form their opinion on this if this child can be saved??
do we have any solution??
we need to think more??
Lynch
(Querist) 16 September 2011
Since this mistake is quite visible and I cannot be employed in 'X' on 7thSep & 8th Sep., I have requested my HR team to
please process the dates to 9-Sep-2010 as my joining with 'X'.
They have requested their auditor for the same but cannot commit to me at this hour.
They shall revert back to me in 10 days times is what my HR team has said once they get to know from the auditors.
Guest
(Expert) 16 September 2011
Does not seem possible at least with your present employer. You may have to get rectification from your past employer by refunding salary for two days, if you received from that employer.
prabhakar singh
(Expert) 16 September 2011
Mr. Dhingra!you can through some more light as i feel you most experienced in the field the question is.please give a second thinking why can it not be possible with present employer.??
Lynch
(Querist) 16 September 2011
Hello Sir,
The fact is now that the miscrepency occured from my current organisation side and hence i approched them since their records were at fault , hence they would change.
My Past employer's records were clear and , hence they would rather avoid changing theirs since they are not at fault too.
Lynch
(Querist) 16 September 2011
Please suggest Sir, should I approach my last employer in this matter and offer them return back my 2 days salary in leui of a 2 day early releiving letter from them.
Is it possible to chnage it from my past employer for whome I am not working anymore and also having a clear record with them.
Pleease advice.!!!!
Guest
(Expert) 17 September 2011
Dear Lynch,
Now you have come with the information that the discrepancy was in the records of new company as they showed wrong date of joining (two days earlier than the actual date of your joining), which you never stated in your original question.
Do you think you would get correct advice on wrong and misleading information on your part?
Do you also think that the experts are here just to presume what actually happened with you and you expect correct solution to your problem without your telling the truth to them?
Your question was on dual employment due to your date of relief from previous company being on 8th Sept, while you reported date of joining in new company two days earlier as on 7th Sept. 2010.
Do you know what is dual employment? A case of dual employment arises when you join a new employer without getting duly discharged by your previous employer.
Did you anywhere state in your query that you joined your new organization only on 9th Sept. 2010 but your company showed you joined earlier on 7th Sept.2010?
Did you anywhere state that you were actually discharged from your previous company on 8th Sept? YOU SIMPLY STATED "releving letter from my previous company(another MNC 'xx') STATED my release from them is 8th-SEP-2010", as if there was fault on the part of your previous company.
You simply stated, what the documents of both the companies showed on their record and kept the experts just guessing on the part of which company the fault would have lied, whereas the actual fault lied on you by not stating the real facts.
When you were relieved on 8th Sept. from your previous company and joined the new company only on 9th Sept.2010, WHERE DID THE QUESTION OF DUAL EMPLOYMENT ARISE?
It clearly seemed that you tried to take undue advantage of two days undue salary from your new employer and you delebrately seemed to have kept mum for the whole one year instead of requesting your company in time to rectify the mistake. You just realised the mistake when the problem actually arose for you in the way to get a fresh lucrative employment and only then you felt the need to ask for help from the experts THAT TOO BY MISLEADING THE EXPERTS COMMUNITY WITH WRONG INFORMATION.
Do you know you have also created problem for your company to write off two days salary from the Profit & Loss Accounts and Assets & Liabilities Accounts of the company when the company has already closed his annual accounts That is not so simple to do at this stage when company accounts for the concerned year have already been closed? That is why they have felt the need to consult their auditors, otherwise there was no need for consultation of the auditors had you intimated the error in the same month when you received the salary for the month of September 2010.
Do you also know that even the company can treat lapse as a misconduct on your part for delibrately concealing the fact and drawing two days of salary in excess of your due salary without trying to refund that?
Sorry to state, you can't do anything, except being at the mercy of your present company, if they agree to rectify their records and are ready to take the blame of falsifying their accounts of 2010-11 from the various authorities of the Government of India, like the Tax authorities, ROC, etc.
Guest
(Expert) 17 September 2011
Respected Prabhakar ji,
Some querists usually try to seek write solution to their problems with wrong information. Here also, the author of the question has come forward with correct information only yesterday, instead of including that in his original question.
In fact, his query does not relate to any sort of dual employment, as I have mentioned above in reply to him.
However with reference to your point of clarification, I would like to say, had there been the case of dual employment, the original date of joining of the employee in the present company would have been a hard nut to crack by the company, while it would have been easy for the previous company to show the employee as relieved two days earlier by virtue of his resignation by showing that the employee requested early release. In that case he could have deposited two days' salary in that company in lieu of the No. of days short of the notice period.
I hope my previous reply on his supplementary information may also clear your point to some more extent by realising what type of problem he himself was responsible to create even for his own company.
prabhakar singh
(Expert) 17 September 2011
THANK YOU Dhingra ji,you heeded my ,request.
Lynch
(Querist) 19 September 2011
Hello Sir,
Thank you for taking out time and answering my query in detail. I am sorry if I didnot put all the required facts properly right in my first post.
hence forth, i am just trying to put all my facts again all in One Post.
My Date of releiving(Actual Date of releiving) : 8th Sep 2010.
My REQUESTED&Confirmed date of Joining(as discussed through mails with my HR o my current Employer): 9th Sep2010.
But,my HR called me (by putting a mail+phone, post my previous mail of discussion of my Joining with them in my previous mail and didnot stated anything in this mail regarding my change of Joining Date with them ) they simply stated that I need to come for a short time on 7thSep 2010, for document submission/introduction purpose with Clients+Induction and filling of some forms for them.The next day, 8thSep 2010, I was Guided by my HR to put a Leave and collect my releiving documents from my Past Employer and come and join from 9thSep2010.
I agree to my mistake fully, But I had submitted my releiving letter to my Current Employer within a days after my joining (before I got my first salary drawn from them organisation).
The fasct is I didnot hide anything from both my employer and acted as they guided me and tried to remain transparent from my side always.
Now the records state my joinig as 7th Sep2010 in the records of my current Employer since that day was my date of induction with them.
and the actual releiving date of my past employer is 8thSep2010.
Hope I was able to expain my case as precise as possible.
Thanking You Sir for reading my problem and taking a great interest in sharing this issue with me
Thanking YOU&Regards,
Lynch.
Lynch
(Querist) 25 September 2011
Hello Sir,
If my current employer provides me with a written document letter stating that my actual date of joining to be 7th-Sep2010 but my date of resuming duty to be 9thSep2010(on account of late releiving from my past employer), and the letter , gets duely signed by the CEO of my Organisation , then will I and my Employer be legally clear and clean in this Matter.???!
If this is not legeally correcting the matter, then what document/content do I require from my current organisation to legeally clear and settle this matter for me and my Organisation , once and for all in future also.
Please Advice Sir.!!
R.Ramachandran
(Expert) 25 September 2011
Either you joined on 7th Sept., or 9th sept. There is no question of joining on 7th sept., and resuming on 9th sept. for whatever reason. If you had been relieved subsequent to 7th Sept., by your earlier organization, by no stretch of imagination you could have joined another organization prior to that date (7th sept.).
What happened to your proposal of returning 2 days salary (7th and 8th Sept.) for which your organization had to consult their auditors and to come back?
Lynch
(Querist) 25 September 2011
Hello Sir,
The auditor said that a 2 day salary cannot be deducted.
The auditor is still yet not comming up with a positive reply and I am all stuck up with the issue as I may just become leagually unfit for any job in future due to overlapping issue of 2 days.
So Do I need to hide my 1 year experience that I worked here and show that I was unemployed for 1 year(the period of this company).., in order to stay leagually fit for any future employments..??
Lynch
(Querist) 03 October 2011
Hello Sir,
My Company has revised my joinig date to 9th-SEP-2010.
I understood from my mistake how big a problem this was for me.
I am thankflull to my company and the legal Department & HR to consider my request on time and thank you all as I feel priveledged to know your opinion on this matter.
Sincerly,
-Lynch
R.Ramachandran
(Expert) 03 October 2011
We are quite pleased to hear that.
At least in future, please do not adopt the "Sab chaltha hai" attitude. Try to do things in a straight manner so that you can have a peaceful and trouble free life.
prabhakar singh
(Expert) 03 October 2011
I am very happy to learn.
To err is human but to repeat an error is inhuman.
May your life run smooth and you do not any more need this kind of service as is of ours.
Take care.
Lynch
(Querist) 04 October 2011
Hello Sir,
I am happy now that I have come to know about it on time.
It was a valuable learning experience.
Thanks a Lot.
Sincerly,
-Lynch
