Tenats right after building collapse due to natural cause in cantonment area
arunkumar
(Querist) 19 September 2016
This query is : Resolved
the 100 yer old building collapsed in rainy season where tenants were not staying since 2010 cause of the dangerous structure.now myself a landlord of the building repair/reconsruct the same structure without offering anything to the tenant.shall i take permission of the court for reconstruction neglecting the tenant.pl advise
Guest
(Expert) 19 September 2016
Whether from Maharashtra?
cherukuri prasad
(Expert) 19 September 2016
You should take permission from municipal corporation
arunkumar
(Querist) 20 September 2016
What about the tenants who were not staying there since 2009 and our house is located in cantonment area in pune maharashtra.It is not under muncipal corporation
Guest
(Expert) 20 September 2016
@ Arunkumar
Such cases myself sincerely studying in detail as such matters are coming to me as routine.
You told me that it is Pune Cantonment Area , and myself now will concentrate on this matter because it is bit different.
I will explain some things which may not be direct ans. to your question but overall background of this situation and picture you will get
1) This old building tenants rights when building either collapsed due to old age or demolished by local govt.as dilipilaed have become question of law which is not yet completely determined by Hon. High Court or Supreme Court
2) There are partial rule discharged in judgement regarding it , that is they are giving certain guideline but not complete guideline and for last couple of years the frequency of building falling in rainy season is more in Mumbai Pune belt and even demolition of buildings in rainy season due to safety has become routine phenomena. In my analysis this year alone Mumbai and around Municipal Corporation nearly 70 to 80 building where demolished by local govt in rainy season for prevention as policy and under various law all buildings where old and dilapidated.
3) Now question which arose what are the rights of tenants whose premises are demolished ?
Maharashtra Rent Control Act (my memory suggest and I read is even applicable to Pune Cantonment area , ) ( But this act is not crystal clear regarding such situation )
4) There are committee formed to take decision what should be rights of tenant whose building are demolished as dilapidated and latter bring necessary amendment in Maharashtra Rent Control Act soon.
5) Such decision is not taken because next year Mumbai Municipal Corporation elections are there and certain other municipal corporation elections are also scheduled.
6) Local Govt act like Maharashtra Municipal Corporation act states when building is demolished because it is dilapidated then it is responsibility of municipal corporation to rehabilitate them . And Municipal Corporation don't pass Building plan of such building unless land lord or builder give undertaking they will accommodate tenants whose building was demolished .
7) Now in your particular case your local govt. is governed under central law that is Cantonment Act 2006 which I have honestly not studied in this regards in dept .
8) Now there was such case which was ruing in High Court while studying I read it was held that tenancy of person whose building is demolished his rights are suspended and not terminated . And this statement was very important guideline for me in such cases. Rather I started taking this statement of High Court as very important precedent in such matter that when building falls due to old age or building demolished by authority since dilapidated then tenancy is suspended and not terminated and they will continue to hold rights in future unless until rights are terminated
9) In one interesting case in Kerala High Court last month , Judgement and Decree was in favor of landlord after some time Application for execution of decree was presented before execution was completed , either building was demolished by local govt / collapsed (This I am not sure) . And suit premises was not existent . So Sub ordinate court held suit premises is not existing so decree can not be executed . But Kerala High Court held building was not in air , even if suit premises was not there tenants in building has indirect claim on land on which building is standing , when building is demolished and decree can not be executed then sub-ordinate court should take steps to hand over Symbolic possession of tenants premises from tenant to Land lord and extinguish all rights of tenant even symbolic from land so in future he can not claim any rights and this symbolic procedure transfer should be done by sub ordinate court.
10 ) Now going back again to your particular query regarding rights of tenants under demolished building I would suggest at this stage looking at various judgement and political and legal situation .
In my opinion all tenants whose tenancy was not terminated from 2010 they have symbolic rights on your land and that required to be terminated completely in your legal interest , keeping pending may make their case strong and we don't know what changes in law can take place.
I would suggest you make all tenants who where residing prior to 2010 , party in single suit , in Court show all immovable properties under their control in any capacity and most imp. for declaration that their tenancy is completely terminated and they don't have any rights on this lands and further development of land in future.
This suit will also take time but it is only legal remedy and solution available looking at this situation.
Since building is demolished in rainy season I would suggest take steps within 3-4 months reason is that such old tenants records are not there and in mean time in person lethargic attitude opp. person takes opportunity and create some adverse record in administration which can be used for his claim in future.
This case requires profession rapid handling and taking necessary steps for going for declaration as above said.
Guest
(Expert) 20 September 2016
One more important thing which I should also tell certain Municipal Corporation (Please note not all Municipal Corporation) under Maharashtra Regional Town Planing Act , Development Control Rules gives more FSI to dilapidated building , or building in which tenants where residing and demolished, so such tenants can be accommodated.
Now according to me this MRTP Act 1966 is not applicable to Pune Cantonment Board , but just for sake of convince and confirmation you may visit
First floor Engineering Dept , Pune Cantonment Board officer Goli Bar Maidan Pune Cantonment.
Till last year there was Mr. Shirodkar Chief Engineer of the dept and few engineers names I forgot (Ask them whether 1) Whether Maharashtra Regional Town Planing act is applicable to you ?
2) Whether any FSI or any benefit you can get to accommodate tenants as per building construction rules framed under Cantonment Act 2006
3) Building construction rules under cantonment act this copy is only available in engineering dept , so you may require that copy also , ask them if you can purchase or is ready for sale and if not ask for copy under RTI per page 2 Rs.
4) Then you may conclude what is in your legal interest properly
---------------------------------------
Additionally if my memory suggest large area of Cantonment board given to public is Lease land , which type of legally land you have that too required to be checked , General Land Register Record too you will get in Engineering Dept. Office . And my memory suggest I saw on notice board Cantonment board have started scheme to convert lease land to free hold land etc.
This too you require to check
(See if you are lease of land then it was illegal to keep tenant in the structure you constructed for your personal use )
So after deep studying only correct decision in your interest required to be taken after professional analysis of the cease .
And Last See the bottom line is how to get max. profit and secure rights on immovable property and also respect your sentiments that you may have that I own land and it is maintained
Raj Kumar Makkad
(Expert) 20 September 2016
I think after such detailed analysis by expert madhu, no further advice is required from either of the experts.
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
@ Raj Sir
Thanks for your kind appreciation . Myself still new and student . If any mistake I do please adjust and correct me .
Law is very big field , and person from every sector require to be thorough in his own sector else there are chances that he can do irrecoverable catastrophic blunders which can be easily avoided by study.
My subjects of interest in Law are revolving around Property , Land and related.
Adjective law presently reading now a days
arunkumar
(Querist) 21 September 2016
Thank you so much Madhu for showing so much of interest being a student.All the best for a bright future.I am a retired person but handling too many legal problems in different courts but i make my own study and then contact the advocates for further procedure.The details given are very helpful thanks a lot for the same.
Raj Kumar Makkad
(Expert) 21 September 2016
lawyer otherwise is a life long student and we do learn everyday. Till last breath, we always shall remain students of law.
Hemant Agarwal
(Expert) 21 September 2016
1. The Tenants have abandoned the building and stopped paying Rent, since 2009 (Seven long years). Further no Tenant has raised any claims, whatsoever nature, till date. The Limitation Act has kicked in and is active. This criteria is sufficient enough to constitute "relinquishment of tenancy rights", subject to availability of documentary evidences.
2. Subject to above the Landlord, is legally eligible to redevelop the land into residential or commercial structures, according to the latest DC rules and the amended MRTP Act.
3. IF the Landlord approaches the Court for any declaration or anything, THEN it would be akin to hitting the hammer on to ones own head. Let the Tenants approach the Court, wherein the matter can be successfully adjudicated in favor of the Landlord, subject to point no. 1 (above).
4. The Landlord should remove the debris of the collapsed building thus making it into barren land and file declaration with the relevant authorities with appropriate documentation and photographs and THEN after waiting for one year, may go ahead with the redevelopment of the barren land, without any references to the Tenants. The Landlord may also sell the barren land to another Landlord /Developer.
Keep Smiling .... Hemant Agarwal
VISIT: http://www.maharashtra-society-help-forum.com
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
@ Hemant Sir,
1. Basically while demolishing building , Local govt. create a file who where residing there and had claim on any respect
2. This file has lot information so it will be helpful for local govt. in future to prepare its case. So expecting local govt. is not aware of such matter is difficult
3. Urban Development dept. of state govt. before rainy season made comprehensive policy how buildings should be demolished systematically and guidelines too where provided to local govt.
4. Before demolition they seal the building and while sealing the building they take details as much as possible.
5. Property tax is imposed on Rentable value . This all rent able value has tenant name which where present while making entry. Decades back so presuming that they don't have old out dated record will be be making wrong conclusion.
6. Additionally landlord will always say tenant left many years back but in reality records are not updated on rentable tax extract for decades and this advantage tenant can get , claiming he left 2 days before falling of old building or demolition.
7., Under such circumstances new idea which comes in my mind for this case is that after reading your suggestion better present to Hon. Court that I don't know where this all people are living etc. try to get summons serve by publishing on ordinary news paper under CPC 20(2) and try to get quietly Ex- Partee declaration. This can be one option I would suggest .
8. Because if tenant rise while construction or project starts then it may delay the project severely in future
9. Question also comes which tenant will leave property so early , by paying less than 100 rs. or so if person get property why that person will leave property.
10. May be Ex- Partee idea which came in my mind after reading your comment can work better
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
Even building falls naturally then fire dept. create in detail report of it .
Rather every accident proper report is created by fire dept. you need to check the file maintained by fire dept. in this regards
You can get entire file under RTI , certificate etc from fire dept.
If Cantonment board took help of Municipal corporation due to lack of man power etc. then record can be in both places because Cantonment board or military installation installation has co-ordination with neighboring civilian area and vice versa routinely .
Hemant Agarwal
(Expert) 21 September 2016
KIND ATTENTION: Madhu
SINCE you addressed your post to me, specific:
1. Kindly Re-Read the querist's Query, once again, this time real more S-L-O-W-L-Y, without sitting on a Chinese bullet-train. AFTER that Re-Read my suggestions to the queriest, once again, this time real real more S-L-O-W-L-Y, while sitting in a bullock-cart.
2. Did the Queriest say anything about "demolition" of his building by himself or by any authorities.
3. Did the Queriest say anything about "Tenant's raising any objections", during so-called "demolition" and IF so, how would the Tenants allow such Demolition ? Surprising, isn't it.
4. Does the development of restricted Cantonment area, comes under any Civic or State authority, to maintain your mentioned records or whatever.
Kindly re-consider your "immature intellectual-arguments /ideas/ hypothesis", SINCE, like you, every expert is entitled to projecting his own views, without any reference to other experts. This section is not for Arguments /Discussions between Experts. No Offence meant to anybody, whosoever.
Keep Smiling .... Hemant Agarwal
VISIT: http://www.maharashtra-society-help-forum.com
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
Sir,
1) Well when building falls immediately Fire Brigade moves in action , and further steps are taken by Fire brigade. So it is always scene partial fall of building and then next steps taken by fire brigade or local govt . Even if entire building falls due to old age then immediately fire brigade with local administration is on sport to check all details including the fact if any tragedy has not taken place. So expecting local govt. does not have report in this matter is not acceptable .
2) This is other big politics going in Maharashtra , every now and then ministers are claiming they will give some protection to tenants or free flat when building are constructed , so tenants are also on ride. And when building collapse partially do you think the legal notice can stop it .
3) In Borivali Building incident Bombay High Court gave stay building should not be demolished after 15 days building collapsed naturally few people died after this incident neither High Court prohibits demolition of dilapidated building nor entertain much in this regards .
4) You are correct they don't have records under state act but same records they have in different name under cantonment act . When I asked Pune Cantonment board office Engineering dept what is your land record whether Property card ,7/12 they said we called it General Land Record register extract . When saw although bit little different it is almost same.
Similarly when I ask details who are present in certain area or building or structure they have same type of records in account dept with different heading for taxation purpose.
Since Pune Cantonment board office is comparatively small as compared to Municipal corporation of Pune , it is like going from one table to other or neighbouring room and overall system is same .
They are using different words but system is same , for collection of tax they have records in Pune Cantonment board of tenants etc. and they have done under provision of Cantonment Act 1924 and now under 2006 act.
If I can find record of tenant in other property in pune cantonment board in pune cantonment board office then how come this property tenants records are absent.
Additionally Pune Cantonment board office is small and records maintained in better way as compared to Municipal Corporation , So chances of getting record is very high
5) Additionally Maharashtra Rent Control Act 1999 when passed its assent was not given by Governor of Maharashtra but by President of India and in schedule of area applicable they have mentioned Pune Cantonment board (please note while typing this sentence myself for checking again I checked it) , so any amendment in Maharashtra Rent Control Act will be applicable to Pune Cantonment board .
6) Since myself routinely in touch with Housing Dept of Govt. of Maharashtra , Committee is formed to recommends rights of tenants whose building is demolished or falls due to natural reason.
7) Bombay High Court have passed ball in hands of legislative assembly citing that legislative assembly should bring proper amendment in Rent act regarding rights of tenants when building falls due to dilapidated conditions or is demolished since cause is same old age non maintenance of buildings etc.
8) State Govt formed committee and they are making report present Maharashtra Rent Control Act 1999 which came in force from 1 April 2000 its committee report was created around 1992 , so for many years this report steps where not taken till 1998.
9) The Concern thing for this case is that regarding amendment for Maharashtra Rent Control Act which is also applicable to Pune Cantonment board. So any amendment regarding old dilapidated building and building which naturally falled due to old age in next year or two when amendment will be introduced and passed it will affect this property a lot
arunkumar
(Querist) 21 September 2016
My land record shows that it is not leasse land but mentioned as old grant.One more information i would like to share that last month when part of the structure collapsed cause of heavy rain then cantonment staff came and removed dangerous portion almost 50 % of the property in presence of the police. but no panchnama was made as there were no casulity in mishap.The part of the structure is still their which is not tenantable or for any use.None of the 4 tenants staying elsewhere in abroad also taken any legal steps or approach the landlord.The original tenant are expired.
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
Old grant land ----
1)
Means Land is owned by Cantonment board and given under Govt. Land Grant Act. mostly
Government Land Grant Act is still partially in force .
Title required to be checked and conditions attached properly should be also checked from Cantonment office immediately.
Please visit Engineering Dept Pune Cantonment Office , first in visiting section get GLR register extract computerized latest. Then ask them under which terms and condition this land is given , please ask for details of conditions attached with the land in writing , if document is not there then give application under RTI (standard form is there) mentioning that you want rules for land given under your category land and please also attach GLR extract , specify them I want only for my land rules , I don't want to study more and how to make it Free hold non govt. land etc. So it is easily transferable without permission etc and I can do anything within scope of town planing rules
2) Cantonment board may have taken on contract some laborer for emergency situation they may have file in this regards please get file zerox under RTI for study it will give better picture what report they created , Laborer don't work free some one may have paid , and cantonment board may have paid sub contractor additionally they will impose charges to you so expect some notice for payment of charges soon like 40-50 thousand
or less or more
3) There is old dispute between pune cantonment board and local police dept I got this news from pune cantonment board staff they say this is not their work , and cantonment board staff says it is your duty to protect staff when we go for demolition so you have to provide security to us. May be at emergency when building partially collapsed that Asst. Commissioner of Police may have send some police officers in uniform just for safety but may not have taken any thing on record.
4) Original tenant died so their legal heir may try to claim in future rights , don't provoke them directly face to face . This NRI tenants can easily give fees to local advocate more and keep the matter pending for years.
5) Instead in my opinion without informing any one try to get ex - partee decree against them , showing local address
6) Immediately do application to Pune Cantonment board to give permission to demolish remaining structure , their are building demolition contractor , give them contract and get whole thing demolished and put big compound like barriers that no one can enter the plot
7) Change all tax record in dept , When you get tax bill you only see your name and charges you have to pay but in tax dept they have proper details and this details may give tenant advantage like , XXXX has 123 sq. feet and details how tax is calculated etc. this record make straight now only
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
Please note this NRI legal heir of tenant give for name sake Power of Attorney to some friend and relatives and local advocate do time pass with such case.
Instead get it done straight , additionally in Tax record you may require to give affidavit etc so name of old people are removed and tell them they are not leaving for long time etc.
This all hidden records in Tax dept too is required to be removed urgently . Hidden record means , You get tax bill etc , on that you see only your name but in record which is maintained in their office they have further in detailed that record you first require to check what is it and remove them for ever in your legal interest
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
Terminate all MSEDCL connection on property of everyone and keep only your connection.
arunkumar
(Querist) 21 September 2016
Thank you so much for ur valuable information.The electricity meter are already removed by msedcl for non use and not paying the bill.There is no water meter for last 8 yrs.
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
Since MSEDCL have removed electric meter of tenant for non use and non payment of bill etc. It is great advantage.
I will suggests you draft application so you can get reply from MSEDCL in RTI with supporting document .
You give details of consumer no. etc or any old bill
1) Ask when this electric connection was suspended
2) Reason it was suspended
3) Whether suspension of electric connection is still till date
4) Details of consumer like name , consumer address , consumer no and meter no.
5) Most important thing try to get Certified consumer Ledger copy of that consumer no. 2 years before connection was suspended or from 2008 till date with stamp and signature of Engineer in charge of that zone .
This Certified consumer Ledger copy of electric connection of tenant is very imp. it contains all details
And maintain certified consumer ledger copy of electric connection of all tenants permanently
6) Similarly water connection details also you get
Guest
(Expert) 21 September 2016
@ Arunkumar Sir,
I made mistake
1) Don't apply for demolition because that paper if you give to Cantonment and if they preserved then it can be constructed by opp. party against you , just demolished remaining portion quietly as if it is demolished by cantonment board .
2) Make this title of land issue clear of "Grant of Land" because under circumstances you can not transfer land in any form or rights attached to anyone so it creates problem a lot
3) While imposing tax for building /structure that record also you require to check in detail in that you will find every one details , mode of keeping such record differs .
4) In engineering dept. I feel Asst. Engineer Mr. Potte will be helpful additionally ladies at welcome section who give GLR extract and most imp. thing while going to such offices you should be ready to have patience and without hurry so they can help you whenever free properly in getting proper records
Guest
(Expert) 22 September 2016
I went through Cantonment Act 2006 it is just another copy of Local govt law it looks like same thing repeated.
Imp. point for you
1) Property tax is imposed on rent able value of premises , so you need extract of rent able value prior to demolition etc.
Which will state all details who was in occupation , how much area , rent received or receivable etc.
2) After demolition of structure you can reduce the Property tax as per sec 83 of Cantonment Board Act 2006
3) Please take care of old entries regarding Property tax
Raj Kumar Makkad
(Expert) 22 September 2016
In the light of subsequent facts, you need not worry and let the tenants claim any right in the property. You move ahead as desired without caring for your erstwhile tenants.
arunkumar
(Querist) 22 September 2016
i checked with the msedcl and found that their meters have pd i,e permanently disconnected in 2006 and 2009 for non use and non payment. Prior to that there was zero reading that means no body was staying there.i have applied for certified copies and for new connection on the same address i have to clear tenants dues.
Raj Kumar Makkad
(Expert) 22 September 2016
The disconnection of power connection long ago should further be treated as strengthening your case.
Rajendra K Goyal
(Expert) 22 September 2016
Agree with the expert raj kumar makkad.
arunkumar
(Querist) 26 September 2016
I am legal heir of the collapsed property but my name does not appear on the glr extract of the cantonment board as my father recentaly expired and my name along with my brothers is yet to be registered on their record.My querry is whethere i can file the suit against these tenants with verbal consent of my brothers.They are unable to attend court as they are busy with their jobs/work etc.THEY ARE READY TO pay FOR LEGALEXPENSES.
Rajendra K Goyal
(Expert) 26 September 2016
If your brothers are unable to attend proceedings, they can sign the Vakalatnama.
Guest
(Expert) 27 September 2016
@ Arunkumar sir,
I was thinking randomly that certain threads I wanted maintain for exclusive purpose because if anyone ask any thing again then this thread link can be given directly . Because question which you raised is problem of this generation .
So it will be kind of you better restrict your question to one type of query so I can use this thread in future by just giving link and not posting same again and again .
"Thread I wanted to reserve for rights of tenants in demolished dilapidated building or building which felled due to dilapidated condition and then rights of tenants in them "
To ans. specific subsequent query about GLR register , I remember you said remark is mentioned about Grant of land or some thing this remark interpretation is required and this land is required to be made free hold on priority.
Please note people are indeed cheating general public for making free hold land. This thing rampart going on regarding all Govt. Grant Land. You need to follow proper procedure for it , may be some % of present market rate too require to be deposited with Govt. So proper legal steps are required to be taken.
If you just jump to Court without making title clear of land against tenant there can be chances of severe miscarriage of your goal and may land you some where in difficult un-expected situation too.
So first get Grant of Land issue clear. And if any query regarding it please after getting information create separate thread and post and intimate me .
I will love to read it and if necessary put energy to study it too , as that Cantonment board office I visit some time for some or other legal work too
Guest
(Expert) 27 September 2016
Please note regarding Govt. Grant Land every organization which owns land , or Central or state govt. or any local govt. the rules and regulation to make free hold or transferable are indeed different.
And it keeps on changing, take for eg. for Maharashtra Govt land out of Cantonment board to transfer land from lease hold to Class 1 land this amendment was done few months back , so law keeps on changing so rules and regulation.
This provision was not there previously , and it is not there for other govt. land too. So all is required to be studied in detail then only conclusion can be drawn whether it is transferable to free hold or not .
Rajendra K Goyal
(Expert) 28 September 2016
Well advised, author has been guided, can have benefit from the advice.
